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to diss Phish on a Roo message board.. well, it kind of goes to show how far the message of Roo has strayed over the years. That festival was essentially created by and for Trey Anastasio...
furthermore, it's okay to not like Phish they are a very acquired taste, but show some friggin respect to the band that helped create this scene, and the guy who helped create Roo.
Without Trey, Roo wouldn't exist, plain and simple.
Erm....I generally think you're a pretty decent poster, and you make some good points, but this seems way off to me. Bonnaroo was in no way created by or for Trey Anastasio. If the legend is to be believed, it was actually Widespread who got in touch with Superfly and asked them to help organize a fest that Widespread would host (sort of in the moe.down and Camp Bisco mold). Superfly instead decided to put on a decidedly larger affair and laid the groundwork for Bonnaroo 2002 (also hence why WSP had two sets the first year).
If you want to go the whole "without Trey, Roo wouldn't exist" route, you can say the same thing for lots of people. It's not really a great argument to stand on.
Post by The Original Wolfman Jess on Feb 19, 2009 11:21:40 GMT -5
I agree with Nol13, when Jerry died it left a void that was filled by Phish. When they first went on hiatus it left a void mainly filled by festivals. They were also the first to prove the economic viability of having 80,000 people show up to camp at a concert.
I agree with Nol13, when Jerry died it left a void that was filled by Phish. When they first went on hiatus it left a void mainly filled by festivals. They were also the first to prove the economic viability of having 80,000 people show up to camp at a concert.
Pretty sure that festivals like Glastonbury had proven the "economic viability" of such an event for far longer than Phish had.
I love Phish, but they are not the impetus for every advancement in live concerts over the past 10 years. Bonnaroo exists for many reasons - to pin it all on one band/person/event/etc is simply incorrect.
^^^^^^^^^^^ Oh so not true. Although Phish is certainly the only band that ever and will ever hold its own fest. where no other band but them play and draw in 70K + they certainly were not the ones to prove economic viability for a large scale festival. I mean I have been going to music festivals since 1985 (US Fest) and granted most do not approach the 80K level, (although that one did) but they still have shown economic viability on a smaller scale. What about these huge (mostly metal) fests they throw in Europe? They certainly make money every year. So, yes, in some ways Phish has continually proven that 80k+ freaks can get together for a weekend camp and have fun and the band can make $ but other large scale fests have proven this can happen way before Phish did. Maybe "roo and many other fests. were enevitable with the demise of Phish but I like to think that things were going that way anyway.
I personally have hit many many more music fests before 2002 than after..(my son was born in '02 and that put a damper on my festy participation) including Phish fests Lemonwheel Big Cypress
but also fests like... (all before 2000)
High Sierra (4x) Telluride Bluegrass (2x) Merle fest (1x) winterhawk (3x) Strawberry (2x) Rockygrass (5x) Laguna Seca Days (1x) Rocks fest (2x) wOODSTOCK '94, '99 although economically viable total disaster otherwise, I'm sure you've all heard the stories Jazz fest (2x) I am sure I am forgetting a few and I certanly left out a few smaller ones that I've been to as well but you get the point and most of these fest are still going on today. So while I give credit to Phish I can't go with the statement that they were the first to prove that a large scale festy could make money. And the "without Trey, Roo wouldn't exist" statement is a bit pretentious and I can not give lots of credit to. Although I agree with the roots of the fest being grounded in bands like Phish, Dead, Panic, ABB
I don't care what you say about me, just spell my name right---P.T. Barnum "As I was walking up the stairs I met a man who wasn't there He wasn't there again today I wish to God he'd go away."
Post by The Original Wolfman Jess on Feb 19, 2009 15:39:21 GMT -5
Well all the ones you mentioned were either not camping, or much smaller than Bonnaroo. Glastonbury did do it first however the logistics in Europe are very different than those in the US. I started seeing the Dead in 93-94, and to my knowledge there was nothing else like it out there. After that I felt the same way about Phish. I still feel those two bands are what created an environment that made mega-fests like Bonnaroo possible in the US.
I was at woodstock 94, and thank god not at 99, but I do not really count either of them. Both lost money, and if anything delayed the evolution of the mega fest it was those two ill-themed adventures.
Well all the ones you mentioned were either not camping, or much smaller than Bonnaroo. Glastonbury did do it first however the logistics in Europe are very different than those in the US. I started seeing the Dead in 93-94, and to my knowledge there was nothing else like it out there. After that I felt the same way about Phish. I still feel those two bands are what created an environment that made mega-fests like Bonnaroo possible in the US.
I was at woodstock 94, and thank god not at 99, but I do not really count either of them. Both lost money, and if anything delayed the evolution of the mega fest it was those two ill-themed adventures.
Every single one of the fests I mentioned are camping fests. aside from Jazz fest. And I already stated that they , for the most part, are smaller than 'roo. Rocks fest is actually bigger(90-100K). Irregardless the concept and principle is the same, and the point was to show that there have certainly been successful fests. going on long before Phish had any kind of fanbase at all. Showing that they did not create the festival scene in any way.
As for Glastonbury how are the logistics any different here than over there? On another note you may not realise or not want to (its not my thing but...) there are huge country music fests that go on, in this country, that are far larger than 'roo and were taking place way before any of the 'majors' of today esp. 'roo itself.
'93-'94 ?? are you kidding me?? maybe I am confused...nothing out there like what?? a Deadshow? a Phish show? or just music fests. in general? Of course there was and never will be anything like a Dead show, Phish tries to come close but falls a little short. Both groups should be respected for what they have done for the music community at large indeed. But in no way did either one of these groups create the mega-fest. Frankly the mega-fest is pretty much the opposite of what they both created as they both had their own traveling circus and did not do other fests with dozens of other bands. As far as music fests. go they have been going on since the mid-sixties in various incarnations and sizes with their conception attributed more to promotors like Bill Graham than any one musical group.
Oh believe me I only put Woodstock up as an example of a 'mega'-fest which preceded 'roo and any of Phish's fests. I am well aware of the negative impact they both had to fests. overall. I have many horror stories of behind the scenes and in front of scene goings-on that would make you sick. I and friends of mine lost lots of money vending the '99 one (other friends of mine in fact lost their business because of that horribly run fest) '94 was a little better we made a little money.
I think I know what your trying to say, Believe me having seen the Dead 170x and Phish 60x they are certainly both at the top of my favorite list and as stated have done a lot for the advancement of the industry in general. But to say that they are the reason for these festivals existence is plain pretentious and arrogant.
I don't care what you say about me, just spell my name right---P.T. Barnum "As I was walking up the stairs I met a man who wasn't there He wasn't there again today I wish to God he'd go away."
This is copied from Spike's "9 bands with the worst fans"
Phish fans came in at #2 for the worst fans
-------------------------------------------- I’m gonna have to start out by saying that this band is one of the most overrated acts in the history of music. The fact that people follow this band all around the world so they can catch every single note Phish creates is simply unbelievable.
On of my biggest problems with their fans is the fact that they’re mostly rich white kids from New England trying to grow dreadlocks and live the so-called "hippie lifestyle." Do me a favor and take a count of all the Range Rovers in the parking lot the next time you catch one of their shows. On second thought, skip the show.
The other thing that drives me insane is the way the fans act like Phish is the only important/relevant band on the planet. They are literally some of the most close-minded people when it comes to music. All they do is completely dedicate themselves to Phish and no one else. How many more times do you really need to listen to “Bounce Around the Room?” Answer: Zero.
They also act like they care about the well-being of the world, when all they really do is eat mushrooms, smoke weed, and drive around the U.S. following Phish. Way to start the revolution, f***ers.
Juggernaut.. it was a slight misuse of words.. I didn't mean it was solely created by and for Trey, but the biggies that were involved, Trey being a part of that.. sorry for the confusion.
Post by Homer J. Fong on Feb 26, 2009 9:14:04 GMT -5
I agree with lik 95% of what Creep posted (damn you, Spike TV!) - back in high school, a lot of the rich preppy kids LOVED Phish - which isn't a problem, necessarily. Me and most of my friends were diehards, and never pretended to be anything that we weren't: no dreads, no attempts at the hippie lifestyle, etc. We just loved the music.
There were the kids who did that though - I specifically recall a guy from my town who drove a Land Rover Discovery (birthday gift) who wore patchies and dreads and would show up to Phish lot and act like a tour rat. It was kind of gross.
Also agreed on the elitism and snobbery of Phish fans - which is strange for many reasons. Mainly, I've never understood how a group that openly proclaims a wide range of influences on their music would attract fans that have no interest in anything but that band. See, e.g. Trey's open admiration for Bruce Springsteen, and the bashing of Bruce by people on this board.
This is copied from Spike's "9 bands with the worst fans"
Phish fans came in at #2 for the worst fans
-------------------------------------------- I’m gonna have to start out by saying that this band is one of the most overrated acts in the history of music. The fact that people follow this band all around the world so they can catch every single note Phish creates is simply unbelievable.
On of my biggest problems with their fans is the fact that they’re mostly rich white kids from New England trying to grow dreadlocks and live the so-called "hippie lifestyle." Do me a favor and take a count of all the Range Rovers in the parking lot the next time you catch one of their shows. On second thought, skip the show.
The other thing that drives me insane is the way the fans act like Phish is the only important/relevant band on the planet. They are literally some of the most close-minded people when it comes to music. All they do is completely dedicate themselves to Phish and no one else. How many more times do you really need to listen to “Bounce Around the Room?” Answer: Zero.
They also act like they care about the well-being of the world, when all they really do is eat mushrooms, smoke weed, and drive around the U.S. following Phish. Way to start the revolution, f***ers.
And clearly you aren't a rapist (I hope) but the way you pop into any thread where a woman happens to be lamenting her lack of ride to Bonnaroo and tell them to come hop on your bus sounds extremely rapey.
Instead of dirt and poison, we have rather chosen to fill our hives with honey and wax; thus furnishing mankind with the two noblest of things, which are sweetness and light.
I don't care what you say about me, just spell my name right---P.T. Barnum "As I was walking up the stairs I met a man who wasn't there He wasn't there again today I wish to God he'd go away."
phish at bonnaroo is going to be a LOT of fun. i think the people who say their 'roo performances won't be highly attended are foolish. and Phish late-night? this could very well be a set that goes down in their long, storied history.
