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Post by lajonathanme on Mar 7, 2007 18:08:34 GMT -5
for the people who think that bonnaroo is booking more and more mainstream bands than before, im pretty sure that joss stone performed the second year that i went which was the 05 bonnaroo, i could be wrong but im pretty sure, and im not saying that joss stone is bad, i think she has a pretty alright voice, and is pretty soulful, but she is very much so mainstream in the sense of the word, ami wrong in that?
Unfortunately those who come before us always want to stay to their nostalgic roots. Looking back at memories and then having the opportunity to "re-live" those memories can fluster us when it isn't the same exact thing re-created (when it is impossible to ever recreate a moment again).
That's just my perception as to why some are complaining about the maturation of Bonnaroo.
We've talked about this some in other threads. It's a subject that comes up time and time again. My view is this:
You look at that first lineup, and it's immediately apparent, AC/Superfly never intended the festival to be a small thing. They got the biggest and brightest in the jam community. I think the biggest difference is that the lineup has gotten bigger, the festival longer, and instead of adding more jam acts, they've added more indie, dance, hip/hop and rock acts. All those genres are more mainstream than the jam subculture. So of course, the result is that the festival will have a more mainstream appeal.
well i have a feeling this thread will end poorly. but i saw joss stone, probably the first half. i hadnt heard of her before roo and it wasnt that bad,. and she is mainstream.. but the progression towards the mainstream has been happening since the beginning. it wasnt a new apperance in 05. 04 was the first big step in that direction and its gone a little more every year (a lot more this year). joss stone playing an afternnon set is no where near having 2 headliners that have a thousand times more mainstream draw then joss stone did. she is on par with fountains of wayne and such... not tool and the police. and matisyahu played in 05. he takes the mainstream corporate music darling to a far higher level then joss did.
we all know i dont care for most of these acts. but it didnt really bother me until they started headlining. and i cant even imagine where we go next year. how can it get more mainstream then tool, the police, the white stripes, fountains of wayne, dierks bently, etc... and im betting we will get a couple of adds like modest mouse and matisyahu. its not all bad music. im excited to see tool and the police. just seems an odd/mainstream combo for roo headlining.
Last Edit: Mar 7, 2007 20:10:37 GMT -5 by Dude - Back to Top
Regardless of whether or not the festival has changed directions to be more "indie" oriented, if you look at the lineup, most of the bands haven't exactly been getting played on the radio 20x a day. Especially once you start getting lower in the line-up, most of the bands are pretty hit or miss as far as who likes them.
there will always be bigger more "mainstream" artists, but at festivals like 'Roo, there will also always be a ton of smaller bands that not everyone in the world has been exposed to.
Post by lajonathanme on Mar 7, 2007 20:48:54 GMT -5
im not saying bonnaroo is mainstream i i am telling the peopel that are saying that bonnaroo is getting more and more mainstream, that its been the same always, i dont agree with the mainstream aspect, because i thik it would be badass to see snoopdogg at bonnaroo, hell i even think that justin timburlake would be amazing at bonnaroo, so yeah i think you misunderstood my post
I honestly think that when they get to a certain point with the mainstream acts, they'll start going back the other way, and scale it down. If they tried to make it bigger and more mainstream every year it would self-destruct. I really do have faith that the tide will turn back soon.
Post by roolacksreality on Mar 8, 2007 12:29:18 GMT -5
oopsikillednana said:
I honestly think that when they get to a certain point with the mainstream acts, they'll start going back the other way, and scale it down. If they tried to make it bigger and more mainstream every year it would self-destruct. I really do have faith that the tide will turn back soon.
Yeah, I agree. If it got to that point they would sense it from the lack of ticket sales.
Post by BonnarooDetective on Mar 8, 2007 13:36:23 GMT -5
There are two kinds of mainstream music; music that got popular because it was good, and music that got popular because someone paid MTV to make it so. For the most part, Bonnaroo's mainstream has been the former of the two.
As far as specific acts are concerned, I can't belive no one has mentioned: Dave Matthews (with friends or his band). There's the start of bonnaroo turning mainstream.
(Disclaimer: I'm not saying this is a bad thing, I enjoyed seeing DMB in '05, they're fine by me)
The term "mainstream" in the world of music became obsolete with the surge of internet exploration and discovery. It's all very blurry at this point. The term has become antiquated in just a few years time.
Post by oatmealschnappz on Mar 8, 2007 16:37:08 GMT -5
While this year's line-up is the weakest (IMHO) yet, I'm quite pleased with the evolution of Bonnaroo. It's definitely becoming more diverse every year, helping it to distinguish it's self from many other major festivals. I may not be thrilled about that many of this year's bands but, that can actually be a good thing. Superfly/AC are obviously trying to keep things fresh and interesting instead of just playing it (relatively) safe by staying within the pre-proven parameters of their past successes. One of the things that has always attracted me to the whole Bonnaroo experience is the opportunity to discover new music....and even rediscover music, bands and genres that I may have once dismissed for some reason. This is just how I see it.
Last Edit: Mar 8, 2007 16:37:51 GMT -5 by oatmealschnappz - Back to Top
wow...... the dead more mainstream then tool and dcfc. go into any ambercrombie and fitch in america and everyone there will can sing ocean breates salty word for word. same with tool or pearl jam(maybe not at ambercrombie. but lets say at a limp bizkit concert for tool and pj instead of ambercrombie). ask them to come up with the name of one dead song and they will give you a blank stare. i guess it boils down to an opinion. but i think you will find your nearly alone on that one. but to each thier own i guess.
Last Edit: Mar 8, 2007 16:54:06 GMT -5 by Dude - Back to Top
Bonnaroo trying to catch some ticket sales by throwing in a commercially successful and mainstream band is no news. For an example just look at Maroon 5, they were scheduled one year... And I dunno^ Deat Cab is one of the most popular bands among late teens and early 20s. I can list about 20 firends I have who consider them one of their 5 favs.
A band like Tool gets next to no airplay, and I don't think they've had a video on MTV since the mid-90's (even then you could argue that they really did embrace the idea of music video as an art form, a visual expression of the music, rather than an empty product of consumerism). They sell loads of records to a dedicated fanbase, and sell out all over the country, without the aid of major marketing, video play, or commercial radio time.
sounds like a description of the grateful deads career. i think too many bands get labled as mainstream based on wheter or not someone likes them. i think that labeling a group as mainstream depends on what your definitoin of mainstream is. the dead were innovators. noone has done what they did., and imo no one has as many legendary songs as they do. to me mainstream is having a few mega popular songs and then you go on tour and play those few songs, over and over again, just like they sound on the radio, night after night. and i dont hear anything new coming out of alot of these bands. its just the same recycled pop crap with a lightly new gimmick. although i give tool a reprive on that one because they do thier own thing. all of there songs sound pretty much alike to me but atleast it sounds like tool and not everyother act out there. i could go see the dead play 300 times and never see the same show. if i went to 3 tool shows i would be very bored the third time i heard the same songs, in the same order, played the same way. i know about the synching it to lights and screens and whatnot. but lots of bands have amazing light shows and still put on a unique show every night. and bands like the dead, phish, wsp, etc... have thosands of fans that will go to every show they can. thats part of why they have larger crowds. if the dead or grab does a 3 night run people will go all 3 nights. for pj, tom petty, tool, modest mouse, red hot chili peppers, etc... once youve seen it youve seen it. go ahead and wait for the next album to drop so they can add another hit single to the setlist and then go again. it does just boil down to taste i guess. there is no set way to define mainstream, its an interpretive thing. but i do respect your opinion. i just have to respectfully diagree with it.
wow...... the dead more mainstream then tool and dcfc. go into any ambercrombie and fitch in america and everyone there will can sing ocean breates salty word for word. same with tool or pearl jam(maybe not at ambercrombie. but lets say at a limp bizkit concert for tool and pj instead of ambercrombie). ask them to come up with the name of one dead song and they will give you a blank stare. i guess it boils down to an opinion. but i think you will find your nearly alone on that one. but to each thier own i guess.
Dude, come on.
You and I both know this is nothing more than an attempt at baiting. You drop in an off the wall Limp Bizkit reference, mention Abercrombie, and you figure that someone will fly off the handle, making you look like the sane one. I love the Dead, but they hit the saturation point with pop culture exposure about five times too many. Your signature proves that. Those logos have been printed on EVERYTHING -- LITERALLY -- EVERYTHING! Want to know why? Because EVERYBODY recognizes the imagery.
Post by HoodooOperator on Mar 8, 2007 18:11:08 GMT -5
oh hell, i know where this thread is goin'......right down the shitter! ....just like last year....and Keith man, i agree with Ryan on the baiting, if anyone mentions the word mainstream, you are always there with guns blazing....we love you, but damn. It never fails.
Post by steveternal on Mar 8, 2007 18:41:30 GMT -5
Juggernaut alluded to this, but it needs to be made explicit: "mainstream" is a completely loaded term with no true definition. It's dangerous, as this thread (and all that have preceded it) proves. I'm not saying we should just drop it, but the question should not be "Is Bonnaroo going mainstream?", but rather "How is Bonnaroo changing?"
yes alot of people do know the imagery. but few know the music. amber crombie and limp bizkit represent the mainstream crowd. for me anyways. if you wanted to find a main strem crowd ambercrombie and a limp bizkit show would be good places to start. adn if you questioned them about dcfc or modest mouse and the dead they would only know about dcfc and mm. for me mainstream has little to do with the amount of fans you have its the "type" of fan. sure there are some touchheads out there but they are in the minority. and i i have friends who wear ambercrombie and gap and love the dead and go to fests. im not saying all things about all people all of the time. id say the baiting was saying that the dead are more mainstream then modest mouse. and in reality this thread was baiting. the op knew what would happen. it always boils down to people going back and forth when this topic is brought up. but hey its just my opinion. i stated it without calling juggernaut an immature childish loser like he did me in the glowstick thread. i simply disagreed with his assesment. i have been personally attacked in 3 different threads in the past couple of days and i havent called anyone anything. ive avoided doing so. just speaking my opinion. i didnt start this thread. just chiming in with out name calling or any of that. guess thats pushing the limits here on inforoo.
Last Edit: Mar 8, 2007 20:18:43 GMT -5 by Dude - Back to Top
i think too many people take it wrong and too personally. if i say modest mouse is more mainstream then the dead, or that mainstreram people that frequent ambercrombie or a limp bizkit concerts know them more then they know the dead it dosent mean if you like modest mouse im saying that your a ambercrombie wearing limp bizkit fan. its just the way it is. mainstream people know what they hear on the radio stations and mtv . not the grateful dead. whether its bad or good is a mater of personal taste and opinion. but its not like im lying about something to start fights. its reality as i seee it. otherwise known as my opinion. it dosent apply to everyone who reads it.
Last Edit: Mar 8, 2007 20:30:11 GMT -5 by Dude - Back to Top
i wouldnt associate tool with either of those either. thats not what i said. but the mainstream crowds at those places know more about/are also fans of tool and modest mouse by far and away more then they are with the dead. and if you went to a dead show most of the people there wouldnt be able to name a tool or modest mouse song either. or anything off the radio and mtv for that matter. like its been said its all in your perspective. but i guess having a perspective that isnt the same as somone elses and expressing it without name calling is being a bad inforooer. .
Last Edit: Mar 8, 2007 20:38:41 GMT -5 by Dude - Back to Top
^^I disagree. The Grateful Dead have more multi-platinum albums than the following acts: The Beach Boys, Bee Gees, Black Sabbath, David Bowie, Johnny Cash, Aretha Franklin, Bob Marley, Frank Sinatra and Neil Young, and as many as Dylan, all prominent mainstream acts. If someone uncovered some long lost Dead album that hadn't been released, it would stand a good chance of going #1. Just cause the radio/music video format doesn't fit the sound of most jambands, does not make them cult or out of the mainstream. Josh Grobin and Kenny G sell God knows how many albums, and I don't see them much on tv either. Yanni is huge worldwide. Don't see him on MTV or hear him on the radio. Not directly comparing those guys to the Dead, but you get my drift.
As a side note, I don't think Modest Mouse will be at Bonnaroo.
well again i dont see it as number of albums sold. or amount of fans that decides whats mainstream. i dont put any of those acts you listed on the mianstream list. again it just boils down your personal definition of mainstream. for me its less about the amount of fans and sales, its about the people who are showing up at shows and buying the product. and alot of it is the way its marketed. i dont recall any radio contests for roo tickets ever. and this year i have heard of them on top 40 stations, metal stations. classic rock stations and country stations. that seems to speak for its self. bonnaroo draws more people then an eminem concert does. is it more mainstream?? its all about your peronal perspective on the subject.
Last Edit: Mar 8, 2007 20:58:37 GMT -5 by Dude - Back to Top
^^^Oh yeah, if you're arguing mainstream as a festival, I think people are in denial if they think Bonnaroo didn't have mainstream ambitions from the start. It might have been more jam oriented back in 2002, but it wasn't like they were resting their laurels on up and coming acts at the top of their game. They went with big name acts in the jam subculture, guaranteed to draw fans.
I mean, you don't sign up acts like The Police, Radiohead, Neil Young, Dave Matthews Band, Tool or Tom Petty without some larger audience in mind. It'd be like booking The Rolling Stones for a frat party and being surprised when a riot starts at the door.
wow...... the dead more mainstream then tool and dcfc. go into any ambercrombie and fitch in america and everyone there will can sing ocean breates salty word for word. same with tool or pearl jam(maybe not at ambercrombie. but lets say at a limp bizkit concert for tool and pj instead of ambercrombie). ask them to come up with the name of one dead song and they will give you a blank stare. i guess it boils down to an opinion. but i think you will find your nearly alone on that one. but to each thier own i guess.
In the late 80s, you could have gone up to some teenagers at a Madonna concert and get them to sing 'Touch Of Grey.'
In the late 80s, you could have gone up to some teenagers at a Madonna concert and get them to sing 'Touch Of Grey.'
i know. i mentioned them...
dudewhersmyinforoo said:
sure there are some touchheads out there but they are in the minority.
but they really are/were a small and insignifigant part of the deads fanbase. that was a small blip on a 40 year career that was long after they had made their mark. they didnt make their mark with that. and if you went to a madonna concert today it would be far different. but i agree there was a very small amount of that for a very short time in the 80's.
Last Edit: Mar 8, 2007 21:52:59 GMT -5 by Dude - Back to Top
HoodooOperator
Stanky McNasty Smells of bar & bad decisions
Constantly choosing the lesser of two evils is still choosing evil.
Post by HoodooOperator on Mar 8, 2007 21:36:46 GMT -5
Keith man, i give you karma everytime i can, just for being a good sport this year, yet you still have hate surrounding you. Where's all the good vibes peeps? You really are making a better effort to not bite when you are being "baited" (except occasionally when you're plastered, but hey, it is what it is) ;D
