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no offense but NOBODY is asking u to work for a company that refuses to offer benefits.
Fantastic advice!
While we're at it, I'm just gonna go grab one of those jobs that will pay me around $100,000. I mean, it's SO stinkin' easy to find a high-paying job with excellent benefits these days!
While we're at it, I'm just gonna go grab one of those jobs that will pay me around $100,000. I mean, it's SO stinkin' easy to find a high-paying job with excellent benefits these days!
He's never worked in a restaurant before.
I'm starting to think he's never worked in general. Or if he has, he's never had a major illness or disease and tried to get insurance.
I am curious to see how KDogg, as well as others, feel about the Memphis City School System indefinately delaying the start of the 2011-2012 school year? They are holding out because the City of Memphis 'owes' them 151 million dollars.
I haven't been in this thread for quite a while now, but it seems that the topic has taken a turn to healthcare. One thing I want to mention.
I came to work for my current employer because of their great benefits package. Before I left, my former employer offered me 22.6% more per year than I would make at my current job, and I still turned it down. At my current employer, I have a PPO copay-based medical insurance, amazing dental insurance, vision insurance, long term disability and life insurance, cancer insurance, and a retirement plan. My employer covers 85% of my medical insurance, 100% of my life and long term disability insurance, 60% of my vision insurnace, 50% of my cancer insurance, and my dental insurance is managed by my employer and costs me $10 per month.
Medical insurance is an important thing to have, and sometimes you have to make sacrifices to have it. That said, I do feel very lucky to have the benefits I have.
Oh, also, if America's version of the Universal Public Healthcare system that everyone seems to be jealous of operates anything like medicare does, we would all be screwed.
I am curious to see how KDogg, as well as others, feel about the Memphis City School System indefinately delaying the start of the 2011-2012 school year? They are holding out because the City of Memphis 'owes' them 151 million dollars.
I haven't been in this thread for quite a while now, but it seems that the topic has taken a turn to healthcare. One thing I want to mention.
I came to work for my current employer because of their great benefits package. Before I left, my former employer offered me 22.6% more per year than I would make at my current job, and I still turned it down. At my current employer, I have a PPO copay-based medical insurance, amazing dental insurance, vision insurance, long term disability and life insurance, cancer insurance, and a retirement plan. My employer covers 85% of my medical insurance, 100% of my life and long term disability insurance, 60% of my vision insurnace, 50% of my cancer insurance, and my dental insurance is managed by my employer and costs me $10 per month.
Medical insurance is an important thing to have, and sometimes you have to make sacrifices to have it. That said, I do feel very lucky to have the benefits I have.
Oh, also, if America's version of the Universal Public Healthcare system that everyone seems to be jealous of operates anything like medicare does, we would all be screwed.
JHam, I have to ask, what is wrong with Medicare? Why would we all be screwed?
and I want to tell you a story, titled: Who gets the heart?, as it was told to me, about how things work and how Medical insurance is an important thing to have.
Guy A, has health insurance. He has worked for a company for many years. He has his insurance through the company, pays his dues every month, and has never had a claim.
Guy B, has work part time jobs here and there, never been on an insurance plan or even had health insurance. He has never paid any thing into the healthcare system.
That is the difference between these two individuals. Their similarities, are they both have weak hearts. Both men are patients at the same hospital, both men are the same age, non-smokers, high school educated, and no other risk factors that would hinder them from receiving a heart transplant. Both men are on the waiting list for a new heart. Who gets the heart? The guy on the list first or the guy with health insurance? Neither, the guy with health insurance was on the list first, but his insurance, is not the best insurance and does not cover heart transplants. The guy with no insurance gets the heart. The hospital can "write that procedure off". Now, I honestly can not say I saw this, but more than one person I worked with said it happened, before I started working there. The biggest problem with our health care system, is Insurance companies. You have a great benefits package. Some people do not have those options. Their sacrifices are between health insurance and food on the table, or the eletric/gas bill. That is a problem. Nobody should lose there home or their car, becasue they broke their arm and the ER visit and surgery is reaching the 25K+
I am curious to see how KDogg, as well as others, feel about the Memphis City School System indefinately delaying the start of the 2011-2012 school year? They are holding out because the City of Memphis 'owes' them 151 million dollars.
I haven't been in this thread for quite a while now, but it seems that the topic has taken a turn to healthcare. One thing I want to mention.
I came to work for my current employer because of their great benefits package. Before I left, my former employer offered me 22.6% more per year than I would make at my current job, and I still turned it down. At my current employer, I have a PPO copay-based medical insurance, amazing dental insurance, vision insurance, long term disability and life insurance, cancer insurance, and a retirement plan. My employer covers 85% of my medical insurance, 100% of my life and long term disability insurance, 60% of my vision insurnace, 50% of my cancer insurance, and my dental insurance is managed by my employer and costs me $10 per month.
Medical insurance is an important thing to have, and sometimes you have to make sacrifices to have it. That said, I do feel very lucky to have the benefits I have.
Oh, also, if America's version of the Universal Public Healthcare system that everyone seems to be jealous of operates anything like medicare does, we would all be screwed.
JHam, I have to ask, what is wrong with Medicare? Why would we all be screwed?
and I want to tell you a story, titled: Who gets the heart?, as it was told to me, about how things work and how Medical insurance is an important thing to have.
Guy A, has health insurance. He has worked for a company for many years. He has his insurance through the company, pays his dues every month, and has never had a claim.
Guy B, has work part time jobs here and there, never been on an insurance plan or even had health insurance. He has never paid any thing into the healthcare system.
That is the difference between these two individuals. Their similarities, are they both have weak hearts. Both men are patients at the same hospital, both men are the same age, non-smokers, high school educated, and no other risk factors that would hinder them from receiving a heart transplant. Both men are on the waiting list for a new heart. Who gets the heart? The guy on the list first or the guy with health insurance? Neither, the guy with health insurance was on the list first, but his insurance, is not the best insurance and does not cover heart transplants. The guy with no insurance gets the heart. The hospital can "write that procedure off". Now, I honestly can not say I saw this, but more than one person I worked with said it happened, before I started working there. The biggest problem with our health care system, is Insurance companies. You have a great benefits package. Some people do not have those options. Their sacrifices are between health insurance and food on the table, or the eletric/gas bill. That is a problem. Nobody should lose there home or their car, becasue they broke their arm and the ER visit and surgery is reaching the 25K+
A few things before I speak of my beef with Medicare.
First, about writing off losses.
The organization I work for is a privately owned non-profit out patient mental health center. Per month, we service about 4000 patients. It is our policy, never to refuse services to those in need, regardless their insurance or economic situation. If the patient does not have private insurance or medicare, and is not eligible for medicaid, or Tennessee's Safety Net program, then we will put them on a sliding fee scale, which gives them up to a 60% discount on our fees for service, depending on their current household income, and number of dependents.
Now, if they cannot or do not pay for the services rendered, all they will receive from us is a monthly statement. As an organization, we have never, and will never (under current management) turn anyone over to a collection agency, or take them to court. After a set amount of time without the patient willfully paying, we just write it off as a loss and move on.
If the client has insurance that doesn't cover the services we provide, like some insurance companies won't pay for family therapy, we do the exact same thing. If a client has insurance that doesn't pay for a heart transplant, that service could be written off the same as a client without any form of insurance.
Second, about organ transplants in general.
I know a man (Louis) who had a successful heart transplant approx 6 years ago, and I have 2 friends who currently need a heart. Having spoken, in length, to all 3 of these people, I know that there are some further issues that arrise when someone is trying to get a heart.
Let me say before I get into this, that I do NOT presume to know more than you about this subject. In fact, I am certain that you know much more about this topic than I do, I am only bringing this up to give other readers a little more detail.
First, just getting on the list for a heart transplant is very difficult. My friend bryan is not eligible for a heart transplant because he was treated for cancer 3 years ago. My friend Casey was almost turned down because he had Thrombosis a few years prior. Lou told me that he had actually been needing a heart for 5 years before his surgery, but had been turned down twice before being accepted to the list because he was overweight. I know you mentioned this, but there are alot of reasons you may not be able to get on the list, and I wanted people to know a few.
Second, the blood type, tissue type, and the actual dimensions of the donated heart are the deciding factors to who gets the heart. If more than one individual on the list is compatible with the donor heart, the heart goes to the person who is judged to be in the greatest need.
Now, on to why Medicare is the devil...
I assist our billing department in billing and posting medicare each month, and these 3 things, I know to be fact: 1. Medicare pays us a very significant amount less than we should be payed for clinical therapy and psychotherapy. 2. We essentially lose money every time we see a medicare client 3. If it wasn't for the grant money we get from the State of TN, as well as our Medicaid and Safety Net clients, we wouldn't be able to stay open, literally.
no offense but NOBODY is asking u to work for a company that refuses to offer benefits.
Fantastic advice!
While we're at it, I'm just gonna go grab one of those jobs that will pay me around $100,000. I mean, it's SO stinkin' easy to find a high-paying job with excellent benefits these days!
Yeah, I just couldn't be bothered with goin' to my local "So You Want To Make Six-Figures and Have Great Benefits" job fair.
no offense but NOBODY is asking u to work for a company that refuses to offer benefits.
Fantastic advice!
While we're at it, I'm just gonna go grab one of those jobs that will pay me around $100,000. I mean, it's SO stinkin' easy to find a high-paying job with excellent benefits these days!
Awesome response
chicagorooer, I know your going to say we are ganging up on you. But looking at your past post history, which by the way skipped from 2007 to now so I guess we have Kdogg's Forward campaign to blame for your resurrection, I'm going to say you like it that way.
JHam, I have to ask, what is wrong with Medicare? Why would we all be screwed?
and I want to tell you a story, titled: Who gets the heart?, as it was told to me, about how things work and how Medical insurance is an important thing to have.
Guy A, has health insurance. He has worked for a company for many years. He has his insurance through the company, pays his dues every month, and has never had a claim.
Guy B, has work part time jobs here and there, never been on an insurance plan or even had health insurance. He has never paid any thing into the healthcare system.
That is the difference between these two individuals. Their similarities, are they both have weak hearts. Both men are patients at the same hospital, both men are the same age, non-smokers, high school educated, and no other risk factors that would hinder them from receiving a heart transplant. Both men are on the waiting list for a new heart. Who gets the heart? The guy on the list first or the guy with health insurance? Neither, the guy with health insurance was on the list first, but his insurance, is not the best insurance and does not cover heart transplants. The guy with no insurance gets the heart. The hospital can "write that procedure off". Now, I honestly can not say I saw this, but more than one person I worked with said it happened, before I started working there. The biggest problem with our health care system, is Insurance companies. You have a great benefits package. Some people do not have those options. Their sacrifices are between health insurance and food on the table, or the eletric/gas bill. That is a problem. Nobody should lose there home or their car, becasue they broke their arm and the ER visit and surgery is reaching the 25K+
A few things before I speak of my beef with Medicare.
First, about writing off losses.
The organization I work for is a privately owned non-profit out patient mental health center. Per month, we service about 4000 patients. It is our policy, never to refuse services to those in need, regardless their insurance or economic situation. If the patient does not have private insurance or medicare, and is not eligible for medicaid, or Tennessee's Safety Net program, then we will put them on a sliding fee scale, which gives them up to a 60% discount on our fees for service, depending on their current household income, and number of dependents.
Now, if they cannot or do not pay for the services rendered, all they will receive from us is a monthly statement. As an organization, we have never, and will never (under current management) turn anyone over to a collection agency, or take them to court. After a set amount of time without the patient willfully paying, we just write it off as a loss and move on.
If the client has insurance that doesn't cover the services we provide, like some insurance companies won't pay for family therapy, we do the exact same thing. If a client has insurance that doesn't pay for a heart transplant, that service could be written off the same as a client without any form of insurance.
Second, about organ transplants in general.
I know a man (Louis) who had a successful heart transplant approx 6 years ago, and I have 2 friends who currently need a heart. Having spoken, in length, to all 3 of these people, I know that there are some further issues that arrise when someone is trying to get a heart.
Let me say before I get into this, that I do NOT presume to know more than you about this subject. In fact, I am certain that you know much more about this topic than I do, I am only bringing this up to give other readers a little more detail.
First, just getting on the list for a heart transplant is very difficult. My friend bryan is not eligible for a heart transplant because he was treated for cancer 3 years ago. My friend Casey was almost turned down because he had Thrombosis a few years prior. Lou told me that he had actually been needing a heart for 5 years before his surgery, but had been turned down twice before being accepted to the list because he was overweight. I know you mentioned this, but there are alot of reasons you may not be able to get on the list, and I wanted people to know a few.
Second, the blood type, tissue type, and the actual dimensions of the donated heart are the deciding factors to who gets the heart. If more than one individual on the list is compatible with the donor heart, the heart goes to the person who is judged to be in the greatest need.
Now, on to why Medicare is the devil...
I assist our billing department in billing and posting medicare each month, and these 3 things, I know to be fact: 1. Medicare pays us a very significant amount less than we should be payed for clinical therapy and psychotherapy. 2. We essentially lose money every time we see a medicare client 3. If it wasn't for the grant money we get from the State of TN, as well as our Medicaid and Safety Net clients, we wouldn't be able to stay open, literally.
Thanks for that Jham. Very helpful, sounds like TN has a pretty progressive healthcare system. You touched onto a good point Jham.Yeah, Medicare just isn't enough. We spend 30% of our budget (highest part) on Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid and yet by all accounts, most people say its not enough. Our population has doubled since the 60s, while the average salary has not kept up with that growth. Not to mention our tax rate is considerably lower than some of these more socialized European countries.
Sweden and Norway offer free healthcare along with free education but they pay 50-60% in personal income tax. America will and always be a 25-35% nation. GDP is the highest but most of that goes to the market. Getting insurance companies to grow a social conscience in helping provide socialized healthcare. Good luck, I'd rather work on lowering premiums.
I actually don't mind chicagorooer. He brings up a good Pro-business, small government, devil's advocate voice that I don't like but are valid points in how those in power help control the masses
Along with Kdogg's tireless commitment to democracy and support of public workers. Keep on fighting the good fight. We have a good balance of political discussion that is both informative and interesting.
Last Edit: Jul 20, 2011 13:01:07 GMT -5 by Jury - Back to Top
quite literally every single other first-world country on the face of the planet begs to differ - and the World Health Organization ranks 36 of them above the U.S. in terms of health care. According to the most recent figures I could find online, we're ranked right between Costa Rica and Slovenia; considering we're among the most prosperous nations on Earth, that's a quacking travesty
I am not attacking Jack here, but rather trying to point out a flaw in this logic. The WHO's top ten list is:
1 France 2 Italy 3 San Marino 4 Andorra 5 Malta 6 Singapore 7 Spain 8 Oman 9 Austria 10 Japan
Now, here is that list with populations
1 France 65,821,885 2 Italy 60,626,442 3 San Marino 31,887 4 Andorra 84,082 5 Malta 417,608 6 Singapore 5,076,700 7 Spain 46,148,605 8 Oman 2,694,094 9 Austria 8,404,252 10 Japan 127,950,000
Now, here is the total population of the countries listed: 317,255,555
Now, here is the total population of America: 311,792,000
On that list, the best performance per population is Japan, and they are 10th. The 2 countries larger than us, by the way, China (1) and India (2), are ranked 144th, and 112th, respectfully.
The US, based on our high population, is going to have a hard time ever getting into the top 25 of the WHO's list.
My idea... before we worry, at all, about destroying our healthcare system, and forcing everyone who needs to see a doctor to go to their local health dept with a sleeping bag and a pillow; lets worry about getting our national deficit unfukt.
Post by chicagorooer on Jul 20, 2011 16:33:12 GMT -5
Jhammet...Well DONE!!! Great posts for sure. That's what i have been hoping to see
I didn't come in this thread to rain on Kdoggs parade. He believes in what he is doing and really more people need to be active in political discussions
I was sadden to see that a forum like inforoo that has such a diverse following of people who all enjoy the bonnaroo fest couldn't find one person in over 15 pages of rants to disagree with Kdogg
So it's nice to see a few others stick their head in and stand up for what they believe in. I have seen it many times on this board unless you are a bleeding heart liberal many feel gun shy to speak out.
it's good to have a discussion certainly on this topic. I for one don't feel that the recall of scott walker is going to change the union members position one bit
Jhammet...Well DONE!!! Great posts for sure. That's what i have been hoping to see
I didn't come in this thread to rain on Kdoggs parade. He believes in what he is doing and really more people need to be active in political discussions
I was sadden to see that a forum like inforoo that has such a diverse following of people who all enjoy the bonnaroo fest couldn't find one person in over 15 pages of rants to disagree with Kdogg
So it's nice to see a few others stick their head in and stand up for what they believe in. I have seen it many times on this board unless you are a bleeding heart liberal many feel gun shy to speak out.
it's good to have a discussion certainly on this topic. I for one don't feel that the recall of scott walker is going to change the union members position one bit
Yeah, my awesome points are going to go into the negative just for you saying that....
And, btw, you should read the whole thread before you claim that you "couldn't find one person in over 15 pages of rants to disagree with Kdogg"... he and I had a fairly long and heated debate that started on page 2 or 3 I think.
As far as your arguments go, I can't really say much. I started reading around page 12, and please know that I am not trying to be mean or discouraging when I say this, but attempting to read your posts made me want to cut myself. This has nothing to do with the merit of your arguments, and everything to do with the presentation of your arguments. Quoting the statements that you are arguing with would really go a long way to making your posts easier to read and follow.
AGAINST Medically unnecessary abortion Government Controlled Healthcare Interventionist Foreign Policies Unions and Collective Bargaining
FOR Equality among all religions and sexualities (except goat-fuckers, they deserve no rights) Stricter Gun Control Capitalism
Just wanted you to know who you were (maybe sarcastically, not sure) agreeing with.
I may lean more towards the Democratic end but I like to stay level on both sides. Except for capitalism. It was nice in its ideal form right after WWII, when people's wages were comparable to a good standard of living. But with deregulation policies that have continued since the 1980's, prices for everything are rising at a level too steep. Which by the way, deregulation has caused two financial collapses.
I remember when $100k a year use to mean to you were financially set for your family and home. Nowadays, $100k a year often requires people to refinance their mortgage, have someone in the family take a second job, and can hardly pay for college. We cannot let capitalism be too rampant, there's got to be a sense of moderation and protection for the consumer. Unions are still needed and yeah they can be misled at times. Example, I don't like the leadership of the American Teachers Union because they want public school tenure but not salary increases based on performance, which has created protection for bad teachers (i.e the rubber room of New York). It doesn't mean, I want to scrap collective bargaining or unions entirely. They are the reasons our working environments are not like China's.
Jhammet, you and i may have differences. But calm, rational arguments with evidence allows us to reach some measure of truth. Those measures of truth are valued more over ideas that are popular.
For Humanitarian causes. Makes Defense policies complicated. Collective bargaining and worker's rights Consumer rights and regulated capitalism (i.e Teddy Roosevelt) Equal rights for everyone Education
Against Confederates (Seriously, talking with some of these people in VA are ass backwards) Deregulated economy Lobbyists State funds for abortion Religious tax shelters
JHam, I have to ask, what is wrong with Medicare? Why would we all be screwed?
and I want to tell you a story, titled: Who gets the heart?, as it was told to me, about how things work and how Medical insurance is an important thing to have.
Guy A, has health insurance. He has worked for a company for many years. He has his insurance through the company, pays his dues every month, and has never had a claim.
Guy B, has work part time jobs here and there, never been on an insurance plan or even had health insurance. He has never paid any thing into the healthcare system.
That is the difference between these two individuals. Their similarities, are they both have weak hearts. Both men are patients at the same hospital, both men are the same age, non-smokers, high school educated, and no other risk factors that would hinder them from receiving a heart transplant. Both men are on the waiting list for a new heart. Who gets the heart? The guy on the list first or the guy with health insurance? Neither, the guy with health insurance was on the list first, but his insurance, is not the best insurance and does not cover heart transplants. The guy with no insurance gets the heart. The hospital can "write that procedure off". Now, I honestly can not say I saw this, but more than one person I worked with said it happened, before I started working there. The biggest problem with our health care system, is Insurance companies. You have a great benefits package. Some people do not have those options. Their sacrifices are between health insurance and food on the table, or the eletric/gas bill. That is a problem. Nobody should lose there home or their car, becasue they broke their arm and the ER visit and surgery is reaching the 25K+
A few things before I speak of my beef with Medicare.
First, about writing off losses.
The organization I work for is a privately owned non-profit out patient mental health center. Per month, we service about 4000 patients. It is our policy, never to refuse services to those in need, regardless their insurance or economic situation. If the patient does not have private insurance or medicare, and is not eligible for medicaid, or Tennessee's Safety Net program, then we will put them on a sliding fee scale, which gives them up to a 60% discount on our fees for service, depending on their current household income, and number of dependents.
Now, if they cannot or do not pay for the services rendered, all they will receive from us is a monthly statement. As an organization, we have never, and will never (under current management) turn anyone over to a collection agency, or take them to court. After a set amount of time without the patient willfully paying, we just write it off as a loss and move on.
If the client has insurance that doesn't cover the services we provide, like some insurance companies won't pay for family therapy, we do the exact same thing. If a client has insurance that doesn't pay for a heart transplant, that service could be written off the same as a client without any form of insurance.
Second, about organ transplants in general.
I know a man (Louis) who had a successful heart transplant approx 6 years ago, and I have 2 friends who currently need a heart. Having spoken, in length, to all 3 of these people, I know that there are some further issues that arrise when someone is trying to get a heart.
Let me say before I get into this, that I do NOT presume to know more than you about this subject. In fact, I am certain that you know much more about this topic than I do, I am only bringing this up to give other readers a little more detail.
Thanks for the details.
First, just getting on the list for a heart transplant is very difficult. My friend bryan is not eligible for a heart transplant because he was treated for cancer 3 years ago. My friend Casey was almost turned down because he had Thrombosis a few years prior. Lou told me that he had actually been needing a heart for 5 years before his surgery, but had been turned down twice before being accepted to the list because he was overweight. I know you mentioned this, but there are alot of reasons you may not be able to get on the list, and I wanted people to know a few.
You are correct, there many reasons people are not on the list and my favorite is, compliance to the medical regime. People who test positive for alcohol, do not get liver transplants. Cancer, history of clots, IDDM, obesity, and lack of an emotional support systems are "risk factors" or contradictions for a heart transplant.
Second, the blood type, tissue type, and the actual dimensions of the donated heart are the deciding factors to who gets the heart. If more than one individual on the list is compatible with the donor heart, the heart goes to the person who is judged to be in the greatest need.
You are correct, immunologic matching of the ABO blood groups is needed, to prevent rejection of the heart from the donor. "Actual dimensions", I think you have been watching too much Gray's Anatomy, I think what you mean, are the body size and weight of the recipient and the donor comparable. Same body and weight = comparable body cavities and the recipient and donor will have the same size heart. Jham, I do have one question, Can you explain tissue type?
Now, on to why Medicare is the devil...
I assist our billing department in billing and posting medicare each month, and these 3 things, I know to be fact: 1. Medicare pays us a very significant amount less than we should be payed for clinical therapy and psychotherapy. 2. We essentially lose money every time we see a medicare client 3. If it wasn't for the grant money we get from the State of TN, as well as our Medicaid and Safety Net clients, we wouldn't be able to stay open, literally.
I think you missed my point or maybe I should have added more details, like were the recipients on an LVAD or a balloon pump, or how many and what vasoactive medications were the patient receiving? I worked at a teaching hospital in California, and in this case, I may have misspoke about "writing it off", (I am sure you know more about medical billing and writing things off, than me, so I will not try to look like I know more about it than you do). The hospital received reimbursement form the state for this procedure. The point I was trying to make, is that, Guy A paid into the "system", he had insurance, and Guy B did not. In this case, guy B got the heart, because it was more profitable for the hospital, at that time. In the end, Insurance did not matter and in fact the guy was penalized for having insurance. I will also say, I think he got a heart a month later, but that is not the point. This is not Mafia and I am not sure if you were adding the details as a way to discredit the story or not, but you say it yourself, insurance does not matter.
"It is our policy, never to refuse services to those in need, regardless their insurance or economic situation."
At your facility, all your gonna do is send me a monthly statement and never take me to court to pay my bills. I do not think every facility is like that, but right now in America, if you are sick and need medical care, you will get it, health insurance or not. The Healthcare system is not going to throw you out in the street. (unless you are at a certain hospital in California) I see your facility is already being kept alive by government funding. So why do we have insurance? why not just pay the hospital directly or better yet, to make sure the hospital gets their money and we all pay the same amount, take it out of our taxes? If you want liposuction or abortion(non rape or medical necessary) or an elective(excluding semi-elective surgery and some preventive surgeries), than you can go and pay at a private hospital. I am not paying for her tummy tuck or his "enlargement". Also, I think in this system you should be rewarded for being healthy, if you exercise, do not smoke, and mainly stay away from unhealthy activities(McDonald's, candy bars, junk food), you will be "healthy" and should be rewarded and receive credits on your taxes.
I am for Fairness
I am against the CEO of my company receiving a 215% raise, up to $38 million/yr, while everyone else received an across-the-board 1.75% raise, while requesting us to take 45 minute lunch break. Cheap quackers! This is the same company, new name, that ripped the American people off, with the biggest case of Medicare fraud in US history. The CEO of the company at that time Rick Scott, where is he now? He is the governor of Florida.
A few things before I speak of my beef with Medicare.
First, about writing off losses.
The organization I work for is a privately owned non-profit out patient mental health center. Per month, we service about 4000 patients. It is our policy, never to refuse services to those in need, regardless their insurance or economic situation. If the patient does not have private insurance or medicare, and is not eligible for medicaid, or Tennessee's Safety Net program, then we will put them on a sliding fee scale, which gives them up to a 60% discount on our fees for service, depending on their current household income, and number of dependents.
Now, if they cannot or do not pay for the services rendered, all they will receive from us is a monthly statement. As an organization, we have never, and will never (under current management) turn anyone over to a collection agency, or take them to court. After a set amount of time without the patient willfully paying, we just write it off as a loss and move on.
If the client has insurance that doesn't cover the services we provide, like some insurance companies won't pay for family therapy, we do the exact same thing. If a client has insurance that doesn't pay for a heart transplant, that service could be written off the same as a client without any form of insurance.
Second, about organ transplants in general.
I know a man (Louis) who had a successful heart transplant approx 6 years ago, and I have 2 friends who currently need a heart. Having spoken, in length, to all 3 of these people, I know that there are some further issues that arrise when someone is trying to get a heart.
Let me say before I get into this, that I do NOT presume to know more than you about this subject. In fact, I am certain that you know much more about this topic than I do, I am only bringing this up to give other readers a little more detail.
Thanks for the details. You are correct, there many reasons people are not on the list and my favorite is, compliance to the medical regime. People who test positive for alcohol, do not get liver transplants. Cancer, history of clots, IDDM, obesity, and lack of an emotional support systems are "risk factors" or contradictions for a heart transplant. You are correct, immunologic matching of the ABO blood groups is needed, to prevent rejection of the heart from the donor. "Actual dimensions", I think you have been watching too much Gray's Anatomy, I think what you mean, are the body size and weight of the recipient and the donor comparable. Same body and weight = comparable body cavities and the recipient and donor will have the same size heart. Jham, I do have one question, Can you explain tissue type?
Now, on to why Medicare is the devil...
I assist our billing department in billing and posting medicare each month, and these 3 things, I know to be fact: 1. Medicare pays us a very significant amount less than we should be payed for clinical therapy and psychotherapy. 2. We essentially lose money every time we see a medicare client 3. If it wasn't for the grant money we get from the State of TN, as well as our Medicaid and Safety Net clients, we wouldn't be able to stay open, literally.
I think you missed my point or maybe I should have added more details, like were the recipients on an LVAD or a balloon pump, or how many and what vasoactive medications were the patient receiving? I worked at a teaching hospital in California, and in this case, I may have misspoke about "writing it off", (I am sure you know more about medical billing and writing things off, than me, so I will not try to look like I know more about it than you do). The hospital received reimbursement form the state for this procedure. The point I was trying to make, is that, Guy A paid into the "system", he had insurance, and Guy B did not. In this case, guy B got the heart, because it was more profitable for the hospital, at that time. In the end, Insurance did not matter and in fact the guy was penalized for having insurance. I will also say, I think he got a heart a month later, but that is not the point. This is not Mafia and I am not sure if you were adding the details as a way to discredit the story or not, but you say it yourself, insurance does not matter.
"It is our policy, never to refuse services to those in need, regardless their insurance or economic situation."
At your facility, all your gonna do is send me a monthly statement and never take me to court to pay my bills. I do not think every facility is like that, but right now in America, if you are sick and need medical care, you will get it, health insurance or not. The Healthcare system is not going to throw you out in the street. (unless you are at a certain hospital in California) I see your facility is already being kept alive by government funding. So why do we have insurance? why not just pay the hospital directly or better yet, to make sure the hospital gets their money and we all pay the same amount, take it out of our taxes? If you want liposuction or abortion(non rape or medical necessary) or an elective(excluding semi-elective surgery and some preventive surgeries), than you can go and pay at a private hospital. I am not paying for her tummy tuck or his "enlargement". Also, I think in this system you should be rewarded for being healthy, if you exercise, do not smoke, and mainly stay away from unhealthy activities(McDonald's, candy bars, junk food), you will be "healthy" and should be rewarded and receive credits on your taxes.
I am for Fairness
I am against the CEO of my company receiving a 215% raise, up to $38 million/yr, while everyone else received an across-the-board 1.75% raise, while requesting us to take 45 minute lunch break. Cheap quackers! This is the same company, new name, that ripped the American people off, with the biggest case of Medicare fraud in US history. The CEO of the company at that time Rick Scott, where is he now? He is the governor of Florida.
About Physical Dimensions of Heart and Tissue Type I was just repeating what I have been told, mainly by Lou, and some of it by Casey's Mom. While I didn't mention it, the physical dimensions of a heart would almost always be directly tied to the physical dimensions of the person it came out of, so I am in total agreeance with you there. As far as tissue type goes, I don't know much about it, it was just something that Louis mentioned. Here is a WebMD article on it though: www.webmd.com/a-to-z-guides/tissue-type-test
About the write off thingy I don't know how that states's medicaid program is, but in Tennessee, if you have any form of private insurance, even if it sucks, and doesn't cover the services you require, in MOST cases, you are not eligible for Medicaid. So it sounds like the person without insurance may have qualified for some type of emergency medicaid-based assistance. It is also very likely that because patient A had private insurance, he could not qualify for the same assistance. With this in mind, another possible explanation as to why patient B got a heart first, is because he or she was deemed eligible and added to the national list before patient A, because patient A was going to be responsible for at least a portion of the cost of the procedure.
About insurance, and whether or not it is important At PCS, insurance is not important, and, as far as I know, we have never persued anyone for money owed in any manner other than simple statements. No threatening phone calls, no refusal of future services, no collection agencies, no court, etc.
However, the majority of medical practices and hospitals around my neck of the woods do not share the same enthusiasium about helping others. For example, my parents were turned over to a collection agency by the baptist hospital that did the (major) colon surgery on my father 2 years ago. The funny part is that the total amount unpaid was $73.16, and my parents never recieved a bill for this amount, just a call from a debt collector. My father has 1/3 of his colon removed, spent 2 days in the hospital following the surgery, and another 2 days the following week in the hospital due to complications. The grand total for this was approaching $250,000, they billed my parents insurance, and got a very large portion of that, and they still have the gall to turn my parents over to a collection agency, without proper notice of debt... pure nonsense
I feel like medical insurance is always necessary for emergencies and unforeseen events that require medical attention, as the amount of work, and technologies used to prolong life and restore health can be very expensive. I feel that this aspect of our healthcare should ALWAYS be private, as I feel that a patient would recieve faster and better treatment, and have access to the constantly improving methods of fighting these ailments that the private sector's research and development provides.
I can see good merit in the government providing free, public, annual (and perhaps required) medical and mental health evaluations, as well as some of the more basic out patient medical and mental health services (like the TN health dept). Again, I feel that these free basic services should be available to anyone who needs them, and that this division of public health should work alongside the private sector, rather than replace it, helping to provide care to the poor and less fortunate, while giving those with the means the option of picking their providers.
quite literally every single other first-world country on the face of the planet begs to differ - and the World Health Organization ranks 36 of them above the U.S. in terms of health care. According to the most recent figures I could find online, we're ranked right between Costa Rica and Slovenia; considering we're among the most prosperous nations on Earth, that's a quacking travesty
I am not attacking Jack here, but rather trying to point out a flaw in this logic. The WHO's top ten list is:
1 France 2 Italy 3 San Marino 4 Andorra 5 Malta 6 Singapore 7 Spain 8 Oman 9 Austria 10 Japan
Now, here is that list with populations
1 France 65,821,885 2 Italy 60,626,442 3 San Marino 31,887 4 Andorra 84,082 5 Malta 417,608 6 Singapore 5,076,700 7 Spain 46,148,605 8 Oman 2,694,094 9 Austria 8,404,252 10 Japan 127,950,000
Now, here is the total population of the countries listed: 317,255,555
Now, here is the total population of America: 311,792,000
On that list, the best performance per population is Japan, and they are 10th. The 2 countries larger than us, by the way, China (1) and India (2), are ranked 144th, and 112th, respectfully.
The US, based on our high population, is going to have a hard time ever getting into the top 25 of the WHO's list.
My idea... before we worry, at all, about destroying our healthcare system, and forcing everyone who needs to see a doctor to go to their local health dept with a sleeping bag and a pillow; lets worry about getting our national deficit unfukt.
Yes, it's true that the U.S. does have a larger population than all but two other countries in the world - but, on the flip side of that coin, that also means we have more taxpayers to pay into the system as well. Besides, it's not exactly like Japan has a tiny population either. They've had their fair share of economic problems as well over the past two decades, yet still manage to provide their citizens with what I consider to be one of the most basic human rights.
Now, to draw on personal experience - I was incredibly sick throughout most of my childhood due to a tumor in my hypothalamus. During my seven years living in Australia, I was sometimes on private health insurance (which, by the way, thrives just fine alongside the government healthcare program), and sometimes on the public option, because the quality of care in the public option was actually pretty high rate. And while Australia does have far fewer citizens than the U.S. to provide for, it also has far fewer people paying in to support that system as well. Most citizens pay a 1.5% tax on their income for Medicare (universal health coverage, not to be confused with the U.S. Medicare that's typically only open to those 65 and older) - those who make more than $70,000 AUD ($75,000 USD) per year pay a 2.5% rate, while those who earn under a certain amount are exempt. Am I saying it's perfect? No. Am I saying it will work exactly the same in every country? Certainly not. What I am saying is that it is possible to provide an effective public health care option on a national level without burdening citizens with astronomical tax rates.
Unfortunately (in my opinion, anyway), the tax rate on the very top earners in this country is the lowest it's been since the 1950s, which has placed an uneven amount of the burden on the middle class. I'm not suggesting that taxation alone is necessarily the key to prosperity, because I think that's very foolish and short-sighted. I think there is a lot of wasteful spending in government that could afford to be cut, and (getting back to what this topic is really about), I don't think unions are entirely blameless here. In fact, I used to be pretty staunchly anti-union up until about five years ago, because I thought they provided an unfair advantage to certain workers, some of whom used that as an excuse to perhaps not do their jobs to the best of their ability. And while I still maintain those criticisms, I also think it's very dangerous for laborers to have no way to make their collective voice heard against the extremely powerful voice of big business.
Getting back to healthcare - we've had a public healthcare option here in Massachusetts for about five years now; it covers 98% of residents, and in all that time I don't think I've met a single person who's complained about it. In the 2008-09 fiscal year, health care cost the Bay State a whopping $88 million, or approximately 0.4% of our state budget. Part of the reason that costs are so relatively low is because it also gives residents the option to buy into their employer's health plan instead of the state-run health plan. And to be honest, I think mandates are the way to go with any type of universal health plan.
If we have 1000 people to feed, and of those 1000 people, 700 of them have an apple tree, the other 300 people represent an incredibly high unemployment rate. Of the 700 people with apple trees, 250 people produce 5 apples a week, 425 people produce 10 apples a week, 20 people produce 50 apples a week, and 5 people produce 1000 apples a week
thats 11,500 apples we yield per week, and lets say that everyone needs 3 apples per week to live comfortably. Divide 3000 apples by the working population (700) and you get 4.285 apples each person. Deduct 3 apples (needed to live comfortably) and each person "pays in" 1.285 apples per week, something that everyone can afford while still living comfortably, and thats with a 30% unemployment rate.
Everyone should support themselves, and pay the same amount to support the people who can't support themselves. It's simple, and its fair.
I think with a UHCS there is still room for a private sector. With new technology, health care is about to explode. The first person to live to 150 years old has already been born and in the next 20 years, you will be able to purchase the 2032 5.6L/min, organic stem cell grown, 4 chamber 4-valve cardiac "Stallion", from Baxter. I agree the private sector does push the limits and expands health care and it will continue to do that. Just like the private schools and FedEx and "rent-a-cop" agencies, the private sector of health care in the unite states will not die if America adopts a Universal Health Care System.
Hey Jack, what procedures are not covered by the state funded health care?
If we have 1000 people to feed, and of those 1000 people, 700 of them have an apple tree, the other 300 people represent an incredibly high unemployment rate. Of the 700 people with apple trees, 250 people produce 5 apples a week, 425 people produce 10 apples a week, 20 people produce 50 apples a week, and 5 people produce 1000 apples a week
thats 11,500 apples we yield per week, and lets say that everyone needs 3 apples per week to live comfortably. Divide 3000 apples by the working population (700) and you get 4.285 apples each person. Deduct 3 apples (needed to live comfortably) and each person "pays in" 1.285 apples per week, something that everyone can afford while still living comfortably, and thats with a 30% unemployment rate.
Everyone should support themselves, and pay the same amount to support the people who can't support themselves. It's simple, and its fair.
Just my opinion though.
You know a lot of people who eat 1,000 apples a week?
In your scenario, there are the 300 people without apple trees who survive solely off of other people's apples (those in the welfare state), 250 people who are getting enough apples to survive but without a huge cushion to fall back on (the lower-middle class), 425 people who are getting enough apples to survive as well as a good amount to store away in case of tough times (the upper-middle class), 20 people who are getting more than enough apples to feed themselves while still adding to a large cushion in case they fall back on hard times (the rich), and 5 people who are getting so many apples they don't know what to do with them (the super-wealthy, those with annual salaries in the high six-figures and upward).
The 250 people who make 5 apples a week are going to feel the sting of having to pay 1.285 apples per week (~25.7% of their apples) far, far more than the people who make 1,000 apples a week and also pay the same 1.285 apples per week (~0.1285% of their apples). What makes a flat tax so burdensome to the middle class is that they have way less to fall back on if they hit on tough times. Your flat tax method may be simple, but I would absolutely not call it fair.
Hey Jack, what procedures are not covered by the state funded health care?
I'm not 100% sure off the top of my head, since I've never actually been on the Massachusetts public plan, just the Australian one. I know that abortion is one of them (except in cases where the health of the mother is in jeopardy), and I'm fairly sure that elective procedures such as cosmetic surgery are not covered either - beyond that, I couldn't say for certain.
Last Edit: Jul 21, 2011 13:38:34 GMT -5 by jack324 - Back to Top
That was a poor, rushed, example. The flat rate should be a percentage, not an amount. I am going to a billing meeting to get yelled at for other peoples incompetence, be back shortly
Oh, and thanks for the updates KDogg! Keep up the momentum and great work!
Thanks!
Wow, this thread has been picking up in my absence. Wish I could've been more engaged, but given the circumstances I don't know if I could have it both ways. This is the first time I've been online with my laptop instead of my phone since just before leaving Monday.
So I went up north Monday & Tuesday. I had originally planned to stay with a friend in Green Bay and assist the office there. Instead, I got sent about 50mi further north to Marinette. Marinette is a town of 11-12k along the Michigan border. It is a swing area which slightly favored Obama in 2008, but went for Scott Walker for governor in November and David Prosser for Supreme Court in April.
I was redirected up there to join another member of my Madison office, DGP. He's a Minnesota transplant, and despite being only twenty claims an 11-6 record on campaigns as of our victory Tuesday. DGP had been up there for a week, heading up the election center out of a lawyer's office. Heading up that operation under him was Morgan, only eighteen but already with two years of college under her belt. There were, of course, dedicated local volunteers working alongside us as well.
My first stop Monday was the Democratic Party office in Green Bay, which was a joint operation for Sen. Dave Hansen and Nancy Nusbaum, Democrats for state senate in adjacent districts in/around Green Bay. I had six boxes of Nusbaum literature to deliver from the Madison office which filled my back seat. On my way out, I got to hold the door for her on her way in. I mentioned this on Twitter before the next item on my agenda, lunch with my friend working across the street with whom I was originally going to stay, and had a response by the time I got across the street. The response time surprised me. Had lunch with my boy before heading up to Marinette. He and his wife had asked the Nusbaum campaign for a sign and I promised I'd follow up for them. I asked the man in charge at the office, and he said they were out of signs and backlogged four or five hundred names on that list.
Drove up to Marinette after that. The law office was on the last street before the Michigan border. Showed up around 2-2:30pm; DGP & Morgan were there along with another volunteer. I got sent out to canvass doors. That time of day doesn't have a good contact rate in general, but I have never had a zero percent contact rating on a canvass route before. I did talk to one person, the lady at the domestic violence shelter who told me the person I was looking for was not at that address. After that, it was back to the office for dinner - Asian food brought in by Sue, a local teacher and one of the volunteers. Another of the local volunteers, David, stopped in while we were eating on the end of his route. He brought up local discussion of forcing recall elections against two of their city council members once the Hansen election was through.
I want to take a brief detour into the scandal that's rocking this small Wisconsin border town, because us volunteers found it rather amusing. The mayor of Marinette is Republican Robert Harbick, who had previously been the local sherriff. On the 4th of July weekend, at roughly 4pm, Harbick had a DUI accident. While exiting the Taco John's drive-through, his SUV cut across two lanes of traffic, jumped a curb and hit a pole. His BAC was .25, three times the .08 legal limit. The State Patrol's dashboard camera video had been circulating on the internet, and it seemed everyone in town had seen the video or knew about the incident. During the questioning, Harbick made a crude remark in response to a request to take a breathalyzer and later admitted he had frequently driven drunk (though it was his first arrest.) Seven of Marinette's nine city council members signed a letter asking Harbick to resign immediately. He refused, and further said he would seek reelection next year. I first heard about this situation when volunteer David mentioned recalling the two city council members who had not signed the letter asking for Harbick's resignation, and the topic was still on the lips of most Marinette residents while I was up there.
After dinner, we game planned for election day. We had housing provided by local supporters (Morgan - from Green Bay - and DGP had been up there for a week, staying with different supporters each night.) On Election Eve, we stayed at housing provided from a local teacher and his wife. They lived about 20mi out of Marinette, and had a home which they had recently purchased (to convert into a rental property) after a neighbor was foreclosed upon. They were along a river in the middle of the woods, and the mosquitoes were some of the most vicious I've ever encountered. We had a pleasant chat with Tom & Gail. He's a teacher, and I'm noticing a lot of teachers are spending their summer vacations working on these recall elections. My favorite story from Tom was about how his brother, a Republican with whom he didn't see eye-to-eye on politics, went down to the capitol protests in Tom's place because Tom couldn't protest while fulfilling his teaching duties - saying that he recognized the benefits his family members (not just Tom) had received from unions. We left them a thank you note in the morning. I had two wristbands - you've seen the Recall Walker wristband I'm keeping on until we do it - and left them behind for Tom & Gail. I had two left, and I got them from a former teacher of mine myself. I knew I'd run into people deserving of them, and I was right.
Election Day was an eighteen-hour day. Polls were open from 7am to 8am. DGP & Morgan went into town for the opening of the polling place. My job was to acquire provisions, particularly sign-making materials, at 8am when the stores opened and bring them into headquarters. One of us three was to be in the office at all times, while the others handled polling place visits & Green Bay check-ins. I was the newcomer, so I left more of the official stuff to DGP & Morgan. I handled more of the bread-and-butter stuff like polling place visits, signs, canvassing and the like. We needed the signs because, normally, Marinette has three polling places. This being a special election, local officials ran one polling place rather than the usual three. We needed to make signs to post at the other two usual polling places which were not in use Tuesday, notifying voters of the only polling place in town. They weren't even partisan signs; they just said "Vote Today. NWTC Job Center." My first job was to post these signs, first at the usual-but-unused polling places and then at prominent intersections around town. This I did inbetween rounds of canvassing.
I stopped at the polling place around 10:30am to get numbers. They were up to 360-some votes, but with the combined polling the line extended down the hallway and nearly to the door. Turnout was actually somewhat low for that point in the day, considering that was for three polling locations in one. It's probably worth noting that the city of Marinette has 11K+ residents, but only about 5600 registered voters.
It was 87 degrees outside on Election Day early afternoon, but it felt worse than that. DGP & I split up the first two routes, and then I did another one solo. Again, it was early afternoon, so there wasn't much of a success rate. Most of the people I did talk to supported Hansen, and with the early afternoon favoring contacts with retirees and stay-at-home mothers, most of the people I talked to had already voted. On my solo route, I took two bottles of water with me and quickly went through both. I worked up quite a sweat. Hansen signs were plentiful; there were more signs chastising John Nygren (the area's Republican Assembly representative who failed to make the ballot for this election by two nomination signatures) for "going the wrong way" than there were for actual candidate David VanderLeest. I only did notice three VanderLeest signs, all larger ones along area highways. After I checked in with a relatively younger man (compared to the voters I'd canvassed; 40s was young) who caught up to me on my way to his neighbor's and gave me another water bottle. That act damn near made him my new hero. About an hour later and still working my solo route, he saw me still going pulled his van over to check in and give me a thumbs-up & thank you before driving off. The people up there are rather nice. Marinette's a great place to visit, but I'm not sure I'd want to live there.
After my solo canvass, I went back to the office. Someone had sent back word that our signs were missing from the two unused polling places. I'm not saying who took them down or why, but it wasn't a good thing for us. The local paper, which DGP called "a tea party rag" but I didn't have much time to read aside from Mayor Harbick's troubles, somehow did not mention the recall election on either Monday or Tuesday. There were a lot of people upset to learn of the changed polling situation only on Election Day. The signs being down did not help. At that point, we redirected two of the intersection signs over to the community center. It was my job to gather them all - two for the unused polling places, 4-5 at the big intersections - a half hour before polls closed, so this actually made things easier for me at the end of the day.
It made things hectic at the time though. When I got back to the law office, DGP was frustrated because turnout was at the lower end of what was expected. He gave me a list of regular local volunteers to call and see whether they could help us with canvassing and/or visibility (sign-holding at a high-traffic location) to help boost our turnout. Nobody was game, but at least every one of them we talked to - as well as those on our "will vote later in the day" list - had already voted. At that point, polling place awareness was my responsibility. I relocated a couple of intersection signs to the community center, one of the unused polling places where our first sign had gone missing. Those signs, fortunately, remained up during the remainder of the time polls were open. The other usual unused polling location was the high school, which was about a mile from the actual polling place. There, I had hung a sign earlier in the morning on my way to check on the polling numbers. It was mistakenly reported to us that this sign had been taken down. In actuality, the sign had simply fallen. It had probably fallen of its own accord, as opposed to the other signs which simply disappeared. It probably just fell before the sign-taker had gotten there. With our signs' vulnerability a concern, my job at that point went from doing a fourth canvass to standing at the high school entrance with a sign. Again, it was just a sign saying when and where to vote with no partisan endorsement. I had two different strangers pull over and give me bottles of water and thank yous. I got a lot of honks and thumbs up while I was out there. One guy driving from the direction of the polling place leaned so far out his window I feared for his safety, stuck his arm out with a thumbs-up and shouted "I VOTED!" as he drove past. It was maybe my favorite moment of the entire day. I was there until 7:30, half an hour before polls closed, before I gathered the rest of the signs and returned to the office.
DGP pretty much had the office closed up and ready to pack once I got there. We loaded my backseat full of all the laptops, cell phones, clipboards, campaign lit, and all the other supplies and drove down to the polling place to meet up with Morgan. She was there to ensure that everyone still in line at 8pm was able to vote, as per the law. Apparently, the three-in-one polling location didn't work out so well. Turnout had picked up as people finished work, to the point that election officials ran out of pre-printed voter numbers to hand to voters. In the end, at this polling place, there wound up being three more voter number slips handed out than ballots cast. The Marinette clerk admitted at the end of the day that consolidating polling places was a mistake; it's probably one that's still getting backlash now.
Once the polls were closed to everyone's satisfaction - save for someone from the Green Bay office sent to monitor the ballot/numbers discrepancy until it was settled - Morgan, DGP & I returned to home base. Technically not home base, but rather the Marinette supporters/volunteers victory party at the hotel next to the office. There were 15-20 people there. DGP gave a brief speech, we exchanged handshakes and hugs, and hit the road for Green Bay.
Results were trickling in on the drive; I knew we had won not from any particular message, but from the explosion of phone notifications interrupting my enjoyment of the Brewers game on the radio. (My phone's notification sound is the Howard Dean scream from 2004, which makes for a lot of interesting/confused reactions from others.) Earlier results showed we were only up by about ten points, but Sen. Hansen's existing lead increased as the more-populated areas began to report. We already knew that we had won before I even made it down to Titletown.
Got to the victory party. I knew exactly where the place was by the sight of a half-dozen news vans with satellites outside. Sen. Hansen had already given his speech while we were in transit. When I showed up, he was standing in front of a camera. I later learned he was waiting to go live via satellite on the Ed Schultz show. I got a tweet from one of the high schoolers interning in the office, saying she had seen myself & DGP in the background. (This completes a trifecta of background appearances from yours truly on the major cable news networks this year.) Coming from Marinette, we got plenty of congratulations. Sen. Hansen won by 66-34 overall throughout the district. In the city of Marinette, our vote tally was 1399-450 (there was roughly 30% turnout where we were working) for a city result upwards of 75-25. In Marinette County, one of the four counties covered by the 30th Senate District, Sen. Hansen won every single ward. I ran into some familiar faces. There was a Madison acquaintance I know from mutual friends. Turns out one of my old regulars at the convenience store job, the one which I quit during the height of the protests, is Sen. Hansen's chief of staff. I also got to meet the guy who hires people like the guy who runs the office where I intern and out in the various campaign field offices, which could come in handy later. At one point, someone who knew DGP led us outside. There's a balloon depicting Supreme Court Justice David Prosser, the one with the scandal choking his colleague, which makes appearances at protests. It was in the parking lot outside the Dave Hansen victory party. We didn't stay too long. I was only there for perhaps an hour; long enough to only have a couple of drinks. DGP and Morgan were underage, so they weren't able to attend the after-party at a nearby hotel. Since we were staying with Morgan's family in Green Bay, going wasn't really an option. Goodbyes were said on our way out. Sen. Hansen is the fifth of the Wisconsin 14 I've gotten to meet since they returned from fleeing the state. We were going to try for a photo op with the three of us from Marinette, but a larger group beat us to the punch. We did get hugs from the senator's wife Jane on our way out the door. We visited a late-night diner, where we got to chat with one of the reporters who'd been covering the race, before we went to stay at Morgan's house.
Morgan's father - yet another teacher I've run into in my recall activities - made us all waffles in the morning; more goodbyes were said and we were off. DGP & I stopped at the Green Bay office on our way out of town to drop off all the campaign materials in my car. While DGP was making a round of congratulations and goodbyes, we again ran into candidate Nancy Nusbaum - who was talking with former Lt. Gov. Barb Lawton, who served as lieutenant under Scott Walker's predecessor Jim Doyle. I wish she'd have decided to run in last November's election. I like her more than I liked his eventual opponent, Tom Barrett. Meeting her was icing on the cake before we hit the road.
Told y'all I was going to be at my second victory party in Green Bay for the year ;D
Yeah, this was a bit of a lengthy story. The way I see it, with the campaign schedule picking up - six recalls on August 9th & the final two on August 2nd - I'm probably not going to be able to share my Election Day activities in such length or depth until after the fact. This might be the only one I get to discuss in such detail.
I didn't come in this thread to rain on Kdoggs parade. He believes in what he is doing and really more people need to be active in political discussions
I was sadden to see that a forum like inforoo that has such a diverse following of people who all enjoy the bonnaroo fest couldn't find one person in over 15 pages of rants to disagree with Kdogg
So it's nice to see a few others stick their head in and stand up for what they believe in. I have seen it many times on this board unless you are a bleeding heart liberal many feel gun shy to speak out.
it's good to have a discussion certainly on this topic. I for one don't feel that the recall of scott walker is going to change the union members position one bit
You're not raining on my parade. I'd like to think we all want to engage viewpoints other than our own as long as it's done in a civil and rational matter. Exchange of ideas is important in a democracy. It's also good to understand points of view you may not agree with. Especially doing what I'm doing, where conversations like these can help anticipate and know how to address lines of arguments or points brought up. I do agree with this point, though:
This has nothing to do with the merit of your arguments, and everything to do with the presentation of your arguments.
I gotta confess, I thought about you on my drive up on this trip, Chicagorooer... what I'm thinking is that I need a jar in which I throw in a quarter for every spelling/grammar error I see in your posts and donating it to the Democratic Party of Wisconsin. Call it an incentive
Unemployment rose in Wisconsin last month. Make of that what you will.
Sen. Darling refuses to debate Rep. Pasch despite the closeness of their race. Instead, the candidates will have two separate one-on-one forums with a local news anchor.
Add Montana to the list of states where angry citizens stormed the capitol, though there was no occupation. In their state, the controversial issue is the governor's stance on new oil pipelines and relationship with oil companies, in light of recent issues with an Exxon pipeline rupturing and spilling into the Yellowstone River.
I have a new nickname around the office, inspired by my caffeine addiction. I'll let today's email from the guy running the office give it away, since he started it by proclaiming it my middle name. First off, a huge congrats and thank you. Dave Hansen's victory was a big accomplishment for our movement and gives us needed momentum going into August 9th. Special shout out to Kevin (Coffee) K------ and DGP for holdin' it down in Titletown. Also big shout out to all the leads team that helped crank out a ton of phone calls back here in Madtown. At least he stopped calling me "Kev-dogg." I never did tell him how close, yet how far, he was from being on the money for another of my nicknames.
Our office is relocating to a larger location in early August, because our operation is starting to outgrow the present location.
^ This right here is the problem. Who cares if what we do costs the state money and doesn't help the american people and in this case the average wisconsin union worker..AS long as we beat the GOP life is grand....Not sure why you feel your opinions or ideas are better than your GOP counterparts??. Both groups including yourself seem to be caught up in who can bring the nation to it's knees faster....
the only stat I follow is american politician 100 american citizen -14 trillion
Post by chicagorooer on Jul 22, 2011 13:32:39 GMT -5
I gotta confess, I thought about you on my drive up on this trip, Chicagorooer... what I'm thinking is that I need a jar in which I throw in a quarter for every spelling/grammar error I see in your posts and donating it to the Democratic Party of Wisconsin. Call it an incentive
I was thinking about you as well. I took the kids to the pool and I seen several college kids really putting on the show to try and get a little time with the local college hotties. These boys would do almost anything to win her attention. My thoughts were they would even join a political campaign if she asked. I could only chuckle
I gotta confess, I thought about you on my drive up on this trip, Chicagorooer... what I'm thinking is that I need a jar in which I throw in a quarter for every spelling/grammar error I see in your posts and donating it to the Democratic Party of Wisconsin. Call it an incentive
I was thinking about you as well. I took the kids to the pool and I seen several college kids really putting on the show to try and get a little time with the local college hotties. These boys would do almost anything to win her attention. My thoughts were they would even join a political campaign if she asked. I could only chuckle
You just solidified your stance and proved how big of an idiot you are. I asked these question earlier, but since you did not answer them I think I already know your answer.
"Before you speak how people from around the world come to America for health care, you should also know people around the world go to France for health care. France has a universal health care system. I respect your opinion against recalls, but that is the law.
Last, I ask, did you get mad when Bush pushed congress for a 700 billion dollar bailout? Did you speak up and voice out against Bush when the Department of Homeland security was built? wire taps? Let me remind you of your stance
... I would rather pay out my ass then have the gov't MORE involved in my life
Last question, You said, union members all ways vote with union leaders, because they are afraid they might lose their job. How do you know this? Voting is private, you said it yourself.
you need to learn a thing or two. Who you vote for IS NOT open for all to see. WHO you vote for is private and is and always will be that way. You have no right to know who I vote for. "...union members vote in lock step with their leaders..nobody dares go against the union for fear of never finding work again..."
If voting is private, why can union members vote for whom ever they want to?"
Oh and one last thing, I will be the first to admit, my grammar and spelling suck(your computer does have a spell check?). You said because, "my grammar is not up to his(KDogg's) college educated level", that you are not being taken serious. Well you grammar is not even you to par with a high school level education.
I guess slaves should have been told to hit the bricks and let's not take them serious b/c they lacked good communication skills??? is that what you are saying.? Only well educated people have the right to speak in this nation?
Only educated(high school diploma or equivalent or in the process of obtaining) people should have the right to vote is what I think you meant to say. Did you get your GED?
^ This right here is the problem. Who cares if what we do costs the state money and doesn't help the american people and in this case the average wisconsin union worker..AS long as we beat the GOP life is grand....
As for your comment about what's best for the average Wisconsin union worker: I think they know better than you or I do what's in their best interests, and I do believe they've made up their own minds on the issue... and they're overwhelmingly in opposition to Scott Walker.
The Republican Party of Wisconsin fielded six candidates in Democratic primaries on July 12th. They included former Republican legislators brought out of retirement, longtime campaign contributors, even a Dan Kapanke staffer who quit his job to enter the primary to challenge - surprise! - Dan Kapanke in the general election. It was nothing more than a partisan stunt, and all the state GOP wanted - and got - out of it was an extra month to campaign. The cost to the taxpayer for this is in the $425-450K range. Our recall process would have been a month shorter and a half million cheaper if not for this underhanded tactic. Tell me, do you approve or disapprove of what they did here?
Not sure why you feel your opinions or ideas are better than your GOP counterparts??. Both groups including yourself seem to be caught up in who can bring the nation to it's knees faster....
the only stat I follow is american politician 100 american citizen -14 trillion
Please, for the love of God, learn how to use the Quote button. Drop me a PM if you're confused and afraid to ask in public.
