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For those keeping score, we've banned a pair of his accounts since he was initially banned and are watching one or two others that he's lurking from. But no emoney, you're not a troll.
where did those troll accounts post? i wonder what he said
For those keeping score, we've banned a pair of his accounts since he was initially banned and are watching one or two others that he's lurking from. But no emoney, you're not a troll.
To be fair, the nature of the ban here is such that unless one creates another account, one cannot respond to the accusations behind the ban or attempt to mount a defense. In some cases, fine - there are plenty of people who post some hateful, ignorant sh*t who don't really have a leg to stand on. But in other cases, someone gets banned who's been around for a minute and might have an actual case and should be able to say something, and they aren't given that opportunity. I mean, E Money really doesn't have any options - when you're banned, you can't even get on and PM the mods to try and explain, or apologize, or anything. So I would take his creating of other accounts less an admission of trolling and more as being his only recourse.
Radiohead, prince, muse, chili peppers, etc...and they are lucky if they get 1 mill, but they normally only get 500 k
then you have third tier : snoop, dre, J z...they get 100 k
then you have 4th tier : black keys, munford byoncee, Prince etcc: they get 50k
i think lots of people have multiple accounts. i've been chatting him all day and he was using one earlier that you already banned when he posted and now he's using another one just to keep up with what's going on here. you didn't really give him a chance to defend himself or anything. obviously some people have a problem with him, but also lots of people are defending him. we just don't like to see anyone banned for what we feel like is no good reason. you guys keep saying jess is not even close to as bad as emoney is, but go back through this thread and count how many have complained or mentioned him in this. i think all of the mods are being overbearing. i know you're here to keep the board in order, but really i don't think you're doing anything but complicating things right now. you should see by everyone's reaction that you're doing something wrong. you can't just ban one person and let other people get away it. so bottom line is none of them should be banned. if someone has a problem with someone on the board, just ignore them. it's not really that big of a deal.
I think there is a big difference between me getting banned and emoney getting banned. In my case it would be unjust because I have not done anything worthy of it.
Herein lies the problem - YOU don't think that YOU have done anything worthy of it. Well, I'm pretty sure E Money doesn't think he's done anything worthy of it, either. And for once, I'm not just saying that you're displaying a lack of self-awareness here. It's more that in a place without any sort of concrete rules, who gets banned and who doesn't often comes down to a whim, or to a subjective decision. Rather than say "okay, here's the deal: if you do x, y, and z you will get a warning. If you keep it up, you'll get banned," it's just kind of a general "don't irritate the wrong people" mentality. And there should be some of that, and I think that to some extent the mods should be "moderating intentions."
But the bottom line is it should be a blanket "If you use racial slurs, or homophobic slurs, or threatening language, or too many dr*g references, or whatever, this is what's going to happen" and spell it out. Otherwise, you're always going to have this debate on "oh, so and so got banned because the mods hate him, but Jess danced on my dear old dead granny's grave and pissed on her tombstone while blasting a Phish bootleg and he's still around!" If there's at least some sort of code of conduct, you can at least point to it and say "hey, so and so does this all the time, why aren't they banned?" and the mods can respond accordingly.
And, to be fair, that's why I think that intentions do need to be taken into consideration. Intent matters, I think.
Radiohead, prince, muse, chili peppers, etc...and they are lucky if they get 1 mill, but they normally only get 500 k
then you have third tier : snoop, dre, J z...they get 100 k
then you have 4th tier : black keys, munford byoncee, Prince etcc: they get 50k
For those keeping score, we've banned a pair of his accounts since he was initially banned and are watching one or two others that he's lurking from. But no emoney, you're not a troll.
To be fair, the nature of the ban here is such that unless one creates another account, one cannot respond to the accusations behind the ban or attempt to mount a defense.
To be fair, the nature of the ban here is such that unless one creates another account, one cannot respond to the accusations behind the ban or attempt to mount a defense.
That's not the case here.
I'm not trying to be irritating, but how is this not the case? Emoney got banned, so he had no avenue to PM the mods, correct? I think that's what Juggs meant because off aquariumdrunk's post that made it seem like Emoney was creating accounts and posting with them. To my knowledge, his only post on a duplicate account was the one in this thread.
Radiohead, prince, muse, chili peppers, etc...and they are lucky if they get 1 mill, but they normally only get 500 k
then you have third tier : snoop, dre, J z...they get 100 k
then you have 4th tier : black keys, munford byoncee, Prince etcc: they get 50k
It was never said he made troll posts since he was banned. The point was well taken for an account to be made to defend himself, and he did. But it did not stop there.
Yet it is in this loneliness that the deepest activities begin. It is here that you discover act without motion, labor that is profound repose, vision in obscurity, and, beyond all desire, a fulfillment whose limits extend to infinity.
~ Thomas Merton ~
It was never said he made troll posts since he was banned. The point was well taken for an account to be made to defend himself, and he did. But it did not stop there.
Made more than just one...or two accounts just to defend himself. Look, I do not see how a guy that has been warned in the past, had a warning level, then starts crap with t a mod over the Karma system, of all things, would not see a ban coming?
Yet it is in this loneliness that the deepest activities begin. It is here that you discover act without motion, labor that is profound repose, vision in obscurity, and, beyond all desire, a fulfillment whose limits extend to infinity.
~ Thomas Merton ~
Post by itrainmonkeys on Mar 5, 2012 19:42:57 GMT -5
Duplicate accounts aren't allowed and he had more than one account before this whole "banning" stuff came up. It's not the main reason he was banned but it added to it.
i post on another big forum. and on that forum, discussing any moderations issues at all on the boards is prohibited and itself result in a ban. i always thought it was stupid. now i see why its not. this thread is bonkers.
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Post by Funky Munky on Mar 5, 2012 19:51:41 GMT -5
You guys are clearly doing an amazing job, I think people are just asking for an appeal. Oddly, I'm not sure why it feels right to stick up for the guy a bit. It is kind of a double standard, he's done some trollish crap, but he's been a good contributor as well. I feel like he's the class clown. He annoys the crap out of you when he's around but you really miss the fun when he's gone. You guys can't really make a "wrong" decision either way. I do think it would be a good idea for you to let the community know when you've finalized your decision and provide a brief note that outlines the cumulative things that it took to get banned, including the main thing. Seriously, thanks for all of your hard work, I have no idea how you find the time to do this as well as you do.
You guys are clearly doing an amazing job, I think people are just asking for an appeal.
Nothing is set in stone and as other mods have pointed out...it's being discussed. We (mods) aren't all online at the same exact time so we're trying to figure things out as best we can
I'm going to say this once again, not that it will matter since it has been ignored twice before, if someone would just tell us why emoney was banned this discussion would subside. If Emoney actually did something wrong great ban him.
And this is not a good enough explenation: [quote author=knoxville board=help thread=26764 post=1027052 time=1330994285 I do not see how a guy that has been warned in the past, had a warning level, then starts crap with t a mod over the Karma system, of all things, would not see a ban coming? [/quote]
Basically you are saying starting crap with a mod is a banable offense? Or that having multiple accounts is only a banable offense when it is followed by annoying a mod.
i post on another big forum. and on that forum, discussing any moderations issues at all on the boards is prohibited and itself result in a ban. i always thought it was stupid. now i see why its not. this thread is bonkers.
I'm glad you see that Phi. It is a little bonkers, but we decided to keep it open so the discussion was contained.
Yet it is in this loneliness that the deepest activities begin. It is here that you discover act without motion, labor that is profound repose, vision in obscurity, and, beyond all desire, a fulfillment whose limits extend to infinity.
~ Thomas Merton ~
nodepression
Bleary-Eyed Bonnawook Inforoo's Waffle Czar & Baron Von Hipster
I fail to see the connection between "making multiple posts on a message board about Thing" to "Thing bothers me". Does me posting about the karma system bother you? You have now made multiple posts about me posting about the karma system, so it must bother you. Why does it bother you so much?
i post on another big forum. and on that forum, discussing any moderations issues at all on the boards is prohibited and itself result in a ban. i always thought it was stupid. now i see why its not. this thread is bonkers.
I'm glad you see that Phi. It is a little bonkers, but we decided to keep it open so the discussion was contained.
A great decision by the way. Stifling speech is a risky proposition. You guys truly specialize in creating a forum for diverse speech and this is just another positive example of that vision.
i post on another big forum. and on that forum, discussing any moderations issues at all on the boards is prohibited and itself result in a ban. i always thought it was stupid. now i see why its not. this thread is bonkers.
I'm glad you see that Phi. It is a little bonkers, but we decided to keep it open so the discussion was contained.
I fail to see the connection between "making multiple posts on a message board about Thing" to "Thing bothers me". Does me posting about the karma system bother you? You have now made multiple posts about me posting about the karma system, so it must bother you. Why does it bother you so much?
I'm going to say this once again, not that it will matter since it has been ignored twice before, if someone would just tell us why emoney was banned this discussion would subside. If Emoney actually did something wrong great ban him.
And this is not a good enough explenation: [quote author=knoxville board=help thread=26764 post=1027052 time=1330994285 I do not see how a guy that has been warned in the past, had a warning level, then starts crap with t a mod over the Karma system, of all things, would not see a ban coming?
Basically you are saying starting crap is a banable offense? Or that having multiple accounts is only a banable offense when it is followed by annoying a mod. [/quote]
As far as I have ever seen this is about as open as we have discussed an issue like this out in the open. I think because people are obviously not happy. One of those alone is not enough for a ban, you are correct. But all three most certainly is. Especially when the starting crap continues over a long period of time. I think we, as mods, are pretty laid back when it comes to virtually everything. I have warned people for being disrespectful to others and they stop.
Yet it is in this loneliness that the deepest activities begin. It is here that you discover act without motion, labor that is profound repose, vision in obscurity, and, beyond all desire, a fulfillment whose limits extend to infinity.
~ Thomas Merton ~
Let's keep in mind that Emoney's "starting crap" was suggesting the board have an option to turn off the ability to view awesome points for all users. The delivery was rough, sure, but at it's core his "starting crap" was only a suggestion to improve the board.
gulp is right. If starting crap with a mod while in possession of a multiple account is a banable offense there aren't going to be many of us left
I do not agree with that from my years around here. Most of you are respectful to each other and the mods for the most part. And when I have seen it go to far, people get warned and they stop. I would think it stands to reason that if you have a warning level already being a smartass to a mod, more than once, over a question/suggestion you were given a perfectly acceptable answer to, is a quick way to get banned. Not to mention the dupe accounts. That has always been a big no no, and everyone should know that. I know he did.
Yet it is in this loneliness that the deepest activities begin. It is here that you discover act without motion, labor that is profound repose, vision in obscurity, and, beyond all desire, a fulfillment whose limits extend to infinity.
~ Thomas Merton ~
Let's keep in mind that Emoney's "starting crap" was suggesting the board have an option to turn off the ability to view awesome points for all users. The delivery was rough, sure, but at it's core his "starting crap" was only a suggestion to improve the board.
Making the suggestion was not the "starting crap". So please do not give people the impression that we do not welcome suggestions, we have always been open to all kinds of suggestions. It was his multiple replies when he was given an answer he did not like.
Yet it is in this loneliness that the deepest activities begin. It is here that you discover act without motion, labor that is profound repose, vision in obscurity, and, beyond all desire, a fulfillment whose limits extend to infinity.
~ Thomas Merton ~
Let's keep in mind that Emoney's "starting crap" was suggesting the board have an option to turn off the ability to view awesome points for all users. The delivery was rough, sure, but at it's core his "starting crap" was only a suggestion to improve the board.
Making the suggestion was not the "starting crap". So please do not give people the impression that we do not welcome suggestions, we have always been open to all kinds of suggestions. It was his multiple replies when he was given an answer he did not like.
I wasn't trying to imply that, so I'm sorry if it came off that way. I have posted in many of the suggestion threads, so I know full-well that the mods actively try to improve the board, and it's appreciated. His suggestion did change, though. From the "delete the karma system" suggestion (which is not the first time I've seen that), to "make it so I just don't see it for anyone else."
I didn't want to give people the false impression that the mods are inaccessible or something like that, because this is an isolated incident.
